Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
+5
HotParadox
Kazza
Big Slick
Peregrine(Endangered)
Grim17
9 posters
Page 1 of 1
Grim17-
Number of posts : 430
Age : 59
Location : Phoenix, Arizona
Registration date : 2009-01-17
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Lordie...my local electric company use to be regulated...the state recinded the regulation and we are paying higher elect. fees already...what the hell can we do!!!...I'm heading for the mountains.hehehe
Peregrine(Endangered)-
Number of posts : 1132
Age : 82
Location : Delaware
Job/hobbies : Gardening, Birding
Humor : lots
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
This doesn't make sense to me. The tax is supposed to encourage energy companies to reduce their emissions to lower their tax, but really they have no incentive if they can just pass that tax onto the consumer. If they really wanted to give the energy companies an incentive then they need to mandate that the extra tax cannot be passed on to consumers. The only way they're going to do anything about it, is if they are the ones taking the hit. Otherwise they don't care, because it doesn't hurt their bottom line.
So much for the tax break huh. We get a tax break, only for it to go into the pockets of energy companies. Pathetic.
So much for the tax break huh. We get a tax break, only for it to go into the pockets of energy companies. Pathetic.
Big Slick-
Number of posts : 403
Location : Dallas
Job/hobbies : Poker
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Big Slick wrote:This doesn't make sense to me. The tax is supposed to encourage energy companies to reduce their emissions to lower their tax, but really they have no incentive if they can just pass that tax onto the consumer. If they really wanted to give the energy companies an incentive then they need to mandate that the extra tax cannot be passed on to consumers. The only way they're going to do anything about it, is if they are the ones taking the hit. Otherwise they don't care, because it doesn't hurt their bottom line.
So much for the tax break huh. We get a tax break, only for it to go into the pockets of energy companies. Pathetic.
It's still a free market. Increase the cost of electricity and you'll decrease demand. It may be a pretty inelastic market, but still.
More importantly, though, if you increase the cost of electricity you're going to make alternatives more profitable. I don't mean solar/wind power or whatever (though it will help that) but small things, like energy-efficient light bulbs, solar water heaters etc... If electricity is costing too much, people might start turning the lights off when they leave a room.
Kazza-
Number of posts : 342
Location : Down Under
Job/hobbies : Physicist
Registration date : 2009-01-20
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Kazza wrote:It's still a free market. Increase the cost of electricity and you'll decrease demand. It may be a pretty inelastic market, but still.
More importantly, though, if you increase the cost of electricity you're going to make alternatives more profitable. I don't mean solar/wind power or whatever (though it will help that) but small things, like energy-efficient light bulbs, solar water heaters etc... If electricity is costing too much, people might start turning the lights off when they leave a room.
But don't you think that now isn't a good time to be imposing legislation that will cost the average family an extra $60 to $120 bucks a month?
Grim17-
Number of posts : 430
Age : 59
Location : Phoenix, Arizona
Registration date : 2009-01-17
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Grim17 wrote:Kazza wrote:It's still a free market. Increase the cost of electricity and you'll decrease demand. It may be a pretty inelastic market, but still.
More importantly, though, if you increase the cost of electricity you're going to make alternatives more profitable. I don't mean solar/wind power or whatever (though it will help that) but small things, like energy-efficient light bulbs, solar water heaters etc... If electricity is costing too much, people might start turning the lights off when they leave a room.
But don't you think that now isn't a good time to be imposing legislation that will cost the average family an extra $60 to $120 bucks a month?
Is it really going to be that much? How much is the average electricity bill over there? I thought you guys had cheap coal to burn for electricity like us.
Kazza-
Number of posts : 342
Location : Down Under
Job/hobbies : Physicist
Registration date : 2009-01-20
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
my electric bill is roughly $400 a month. and no, our heat is notKazza wrote:Grim17 wrote:Kazza wrote:It's still a free market. Increase the cost of electricity and you'll decrease demand. It may be a pretty inelastic market, but still.
More importantly, though, if you increase the cost of electricity you're going to make alternatives more profitable. I don't mean solar/wind power or whatever (though it will help that) but small things, like energy-efficient light bulbs, solar water heaters etc... If electricity is costing too much, people might start turning the lights off when they leave a room.
But don't you think that now isn't a good time to be imposing legislation that will cost the average family an extra $60 to $120 bucks a month?
Is it really going to be that much? How much is the average electricity bill over there? I thought you guys had cheap coal to burn for electricity like us.
electric. in the summer, we rarely run the central ac because the
house is generally comfortable, as you may recall, K. but the pool,
even with out a heater, brings the bill up significantly. electricity is
insanely expensive.
HotParadox-
Number of posts : 4051
Location : Boston
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Mine is about $200 a month. But I aint high falutin like HP, our swimin hole is the creek behind our house, or there's an apt complex across the street I been known to sneek into.
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Kazza wrote:Big Slick wrote:This doesn't make sense to me. The tax is supposed to encourage energy companies to reduce their emissions to lower their tax, but really they have no incentive if they can just pass that tax onto the consumer. If they really wanted to give the energy companies an incentive then they need to mandate that the extra tax cannot be passed on to consumers. The only way they're going to do anything about it, is if they are the ones taking the hit. Otherwise they don't care, because it doesn't hurt their bottom line.
So much for the tax break huh. We get a tax break, only for it to go into the pockets of energy companies. Pathetic.
It's still a free market. Increase the cost of electricity and you'll decrease demand. It may be a pretty inelastic market, but still.
More importantly, though, if you increase the cost of electricity you're going to make alternatives more profitable. I don't mean solar/wind power or whatever (though it will help that) but small things, like energy-efficient light bulbs, solar water heaters etc... If electricity is costing too much, people might start turning the lights off when they leave a room.
I think we have sufficient motivation now to come up with new ways (energies) to power us. It may be the one thing that could save the economy of not just the US. It may save the economy of the world. I would not support needlessly raising costs at this time as a means to motivate towards creating new supplies of power.
Theophilus-
Number of posts : 914
Location : Beautiful Northern California.
Humor : I miss the humor in what people say at times.
Registration date : 2009-01-15
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
HotParadox wrote:my electric bill is roughly $400 a month. and no, our heat is notKazza wrote:Grim17 wrote:Kazza wrote:It's still a free market. Increase the cost of electricity and you'll decrease demand. It may be a pretty inelastic market, but still.
More importantly, though, if you increase the cost of electricity you're going to make alternatives more profitable. I don't mean solar/wind power or whatever (though it will help that) but small things, like energy-efficient light bulbs, solar water heaters etc... If electricity is costing too much, people might start turning the lights off when they leave a room.
But don't you think that now isn't a good time to be imposing legislation that will cost the average family an extra $60 to $120 bucks a month?
Is it really going to be that much? How much is the average electricity bill over there? I thought you guys had cheap coal to burn for electricity like us.
electric. in the summer, we rarely run the central ac because the
house is generally comfortable, as you may recall, K. but the pool,
even with out a heater, brings the bill up significantly. electricity is
insanely expensive.
Wow. Expensive over there. We had 4-5 ppl living in our house, and even with the A/C on all summer (110+ degree days), ours was $80 a month. I guess we must get really cheap electricity here.
Kazza-
Number of posts : 342
Location : Down Under
Job/hobbies : Physicist
Registration date : 2009-01-20
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
don't forget though, k, we're a family of six, everybody's got a computer and a TV, and their own lights on, etc, etc plus it's a big house. if you're talking about an average 2200 2q.ft. house with 2 to 4 people, at least the bill would be somewhat manageable. tha's the problem with having a big family. you need space and space costs money.Kazza wrote:HotParadox wrote:my electric bill is roughly $400 a month. and no, our heat is notKazza wrote:Grim17 wrote:Kazza wrote:It's still a free market. Increase the cost of electricity and you'll decrease demand. It may be a pretty inelastic market, but still.
More importantly, though, if you increase the cost of electricity you're going to make alternatives more profitable. I don't mean solar/wind power or whatever (though it will help that) but small things, like energy-efficient light bulbs, solar water heaters etc... If electricity is costing too much, people might start turning the lights off when they leave a room.
But don't you think that now isn't a good time to be imposing legislation that will cost the average family an extra $60 to $120 bucks a month?
Is it really going to be that much? How much is the average electricity bill over there? I thought you guys had cheap coal to burn for electricity like us.
electric. in the summer, we rarely run the central ac because the
house is generally comfortable, as you may recall, K. but the pool,
even with out a heater, brings the bill up significantly. electricity is
insanely expensive.
Wow. Expensive over there. We had 4-5 ppl living in our house, and even with the A/C on all summer (110+ degree days), ours was $80 a month. I guess we must get really cheap electricity here.
HotParadox-
Number of posts : 4051
Location : Boston
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
ya well someday, i'll be right there with you, sweetie. we're blessed with a big family, and we wanted every one of them, but if we knew then what we know now, we'd have probably done the long term math a little more efficiently.CarolinaHound wrote:Mine is about $200 a month. But I aint high falutin like HP, our swimin hole is the creek behind our house, or there's an apt complex across the street I been known to sneek into.
HotParadox-
Number of posts : 4051
Location : Boston
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
\HotParadox wrote:ya well someday, i'll be right there with you, sweetie. we're blessed with a big family, and we wanted every one of them, but if we knew then what we know now, we'd have probably done the long term math a little more efficiently.CarolinaHound wrote:Mine is about $200 a month. But I aint high falutin like HP, our swimin hole is the creek behind our house, or there's an apt complex across the street I been known to sneek into.
Well I don't believe that you would have changed one thing about having your kids. And I got ya all beat. I live in the mountains and only pay 59 dollars a month on our utilities on a levelized account.
Old Timer-
Number of posts : 4718
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
of course you're right and now that i have them i wouldn't want it any other way. but back in the day when we were deciding how big a family we wanted... well let me put it this way. you can't miss what you never had.Old Timer wrote:\HotParadox wrote:ya well someday, i'll be right there with you, sweetie. we're blessed with a big family, and we wanted every one of them, but if we knew then what we know now, we'd have probably done the long term math a little more efficiently.CarolinaHound wrote:Mine is about $200 a month. But I aint high falutin like HP, our swimin hole is the creek behind our house, or there's an apt complex across the street I been known to sneek into.
Well I don't believe that you would have changed one thing about having your kids. And I got ya all beat. I live in the mountains and only pay 59 dollars a month on our utilities on a levelized account.
HotParadox-
Number of posts : 4051
Location : Boston
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
HotParadox wrote:ya well someday, i'll be right there with you, sweetie. we're blessed with a big family, and we wanted every one of them, but if we knew then what we know now, we'd have probably done the long term math a little more efficiently.CarolinaHound wrote:Mine is about $200 a month. But I aint high falutin like HP, our swimin hole is the creek behind our house, or there's an apt complex across the street I been known to sneek into.
I understand, I wouldn't trade my kids for the world, but I do wish I'd of thought more about my situation before hand, or known more about what the situations would turn out to be.
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
same thing happened here a acouple of years ago, peregrine.Peregrine(Endangered) wrote:Lordie...my local electric company use to be regulated...the state recinded the regulation and we are paying higher elect. fees already...what the hell can we do!!!...I'm heading for the mountains.hehehe
when our 2 kids were here and tons of their friends leaving lights on; opening the refrigerator 100 times a day; constantly using the microwave; playing guitars, video games, computers, radios, etc. etc. - our electric ran around $110 a month before the state deregulated our power supply.
now, with just myself & my husband here - the bill averages $290 in winter (oil heat stays on 66 degrees) and $415 in summer w/ fans/air running only when absolutely necessary (above 80 degrees or super high humidity). we pay 25 cents per kilowatt for electricity and we are due for planned increases again in april, june and august that have nothing to do with obama's plan.
i don't get how he expects people to pay these bills... especially in this economy.
CV
Susan aka CV- Number of posts : 380
Location : Connecticut - for now anyway
Registration date : 2009-02-28
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
AMEN to that hp. as you know, i've only got 2... but if i knew then what i know now, i can promise you they wouldn't be here.HotParadox wrote:you can't miss what you never had.
this isn't the world i envisioned for my kids and i hate that i ever brought them into it. they deserve better than this - and it kills me to think what the future is going to do to them....
CV
Susan aka CV- Number of posts : 380
Location : Connecticut - for now anyway
Registration date : 2009-02-28
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
no. that's silly. think about how blessed you are. and every decade in history has its ups and downs. if everybody felt that way there be nobody having kids. i know you're down right now, but i know you well enough to know that you're speaking emotionally right now, which is completely understandable. but trust me, our kids are going to be just fine. and when you have grandchildren you are going to be so happy that you had your boy and girl. you're just a little worry wart.Susan aka CV wrote:AMEN to that hp. as you know, i've only got 2... but if i knew then what i know now, i can promise you they wouldn't be here.HotParadox wrote:you can't miss what you never had.
this isn't the world i envisioned for my kids and i hate that i ever brought them into it. they deserve better than this - and it kills me to think what the future is going to do to them....
CV
xov
HotParadox-
Number of posts : 4051
Location : Boston
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
don't get me wrong... i realize that i am very blessed to have my kids. even though they can be a pain at times, i - like you - adore my kids.HotParadox wrote:no. that's silly. think about how blessed you are. and every decade in history has its ups and downs. if everybody felt that way there be nobody having kids. i know you're down right now, but i know you well enough to know that you're speaking emotionally right now, which is completely understandable. but trust me, our kids are going to be just fine. and when you have grandchildren you are going to be so happy that you had your boy and girl. you're just a little worry wart.Susan aka CV wrote:AMEN to that hp. as you know, i've only got 2... but if i knew then what i know now, i can promise you they wouldn't be here.HotParadox wrote:you can't miss what you never had.
this isn't the world i envisioned for my kids and i hate that i ever brought them into it. they deserve better than this - and it kills me to think what the future is going to do to them....
CV
xov
but that doesn't have anything to do with what i'm saying... and even less to do with me. you know me well enough to know that i'm not one who ignores the writing on the wall - and what i'm reading there doesn't sound like a bedtime story for my kids' future.
look at what's happened and where things are going - these aren't the same economic "ups and downs" that you and i have experienced over the years. as of april 2009 - NEXT MONTH - this will OFFICIALLY be the worse recession since the great depression. look at the debt this government is piling on our kids; the lack of affordable education; the lack of employment opportunities - especially with benefits i.e. health insurance; the lack of U.S. manufacturing; the lack of access to credit; the lack of their ability to save because it takes everything they make just to survive; etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.. now add to that the increase of crime and threats to their overall safety and a president who has no freakin' idea what he's doing... i'm sorry girl, but i think they have a tough life ahead of them, and yes - i hate that i'm the one who brought them into it.
i don't know what to say except that you and i are different people when it comes to this kind of thought process, val. you are the optimistic one, while as i watch what's happening, i prefer a stare-down with the devil....
but hey, think of it this way - if you're right and everything turns out okay for our kids, i'll admit that i was wrong, they'll all be great and i'll be pleasantly and graciously surprised.
xoxo
Susan aka CV- Number of posts : 380
Location : Connecticut - for now anyway
Registration date : 2009-02-28
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
this is not meant to down play anything that you've said, because imo, you are spot on. all i can tell you is to have faith that God will do His will for His good and ultimately our good. the devil loves it when we are fearful because it is testimony that we have little faith that God will do what's ultimately for His and our benefit. He's the source of my optimism and i know that you are a woman of faith, so please don't despair. it's our job to do the best we can and then allow Him to be the manager of all the outcomes of our lives.Susan aka CV wrote:don't get me wrong... i realize that i am very blessed to have my kids. even though they can be a pain at times, i - like you - adore my kids.HotParadox wrote:no. that's silly. think about how blessed you are. and every decade in history has its ups and downs. if everybody felt that way there be nobody having kids. i know you're down right now, but i know you well enough to know that you're speaking emotionally right now, which is completely understandable. but trust me, our kids are going to be just fine. and when you have grandchildren you are going to be so happy that you had your boy and girl. you're just a little worry wart.Susan aka CV wrote:AMEN to that hp. as you know, i've only got 2... but if i knew then what i know now, i can promise you they wouldn't be here.HotParadox wrote:you can't miss what you never had.
this isn't the world i envisioned for my kids and i hate that i ever brought them into it. they deserve better than this - and it kills me to think what the future is going to do to them....
CV
xov
but that doesn't have anything to do with what i'm saying... and even less to do with me. you know me well enough to know that i'm not one who ignores the writing on the wall - and what i'm reading there doesn't sound like a bedtime story for my kids' future.
look at what's happened and where things are going - these aren't the same economic "ups and downs" that you and i have experienced over the years. as of april 2009 - NEXT MONTH - this will OFFICIALLY be the worse recession since the great depression. look at the debt this government is piling on our kids; the lack of affordable education; the lack of employment opportunities - especially with benefits i.e. health insurance; the lack of U.S. manufacturing; the lack of access to credit; the lack of their ability to save because it takes everything they make just to survive; etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.. now add to that the increase of crime and threats to their overall safety and a president who has no freakin' idea what he's doing... i'm sorry girl, but i think they have a tough life ahead of them, and yes - i hate that i'm the one who brought them into it.
i don't know what to say except that you and i are different people when it comes to this kind of thought process, val. you are the optimistic one, while as i watch what's happening, i prefer a stare-down with the devil....
but hey, think of it this way - if you're right and everything turns out okay for our kids, i'll admit that i was wrong, they'll all be great and i'll be pleasantly and graciously surprised.
xoxo
HotParadox-
Number of posts : 4051
Location : Boston
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
so val, you're telling me "this too, shall pass"..?HotParadox wrote:this is not meant to down play anything that you've said, because imo, you are spot on. all i can tell you is to have faith that God will do His will for His good and ultimately our good. the devil loves it when we are fearful because it is testimony that we have little faith that God will do what's ultimately for His and our benefit. He's the source of my optimism and i know that you are a woman of faith, so please don't despair. it's our job to do the best we can and then allow Him to be the manager of all the outcomes of our lives.
well girl - i hope you have enough faith for both of us on this one, cuz this is one time i'll believe it when i see it happen.
gluttony got us into this mess; we all played a part in it on one level or another; and i'm not asking, nor do i expect God to intervene in the outcome. but that's me. i'll deal with it.
just know i hear what you're saying from your heart, and for that - i love you and thank you.
xoxo
Last edited by Susan aka CV on Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
Susan aka CV- Number of posts : 380
Location : Connecticut - for now anyway
Registration date : 2009-02-28
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Susan aka CV wrote:same thing happened here a acouple of years ago, peregrine.Peregrine(Endangered) wrote:Lordie...my local electric company use to be regulated...the state recinded the regulation and we are paying higher elect. fees already...what the hell can we do!!!...I'm heading for the mountains.hehehe
when our 2 kids were here and tons of their friends leaving lights on; opening the refrigerator 100 times a day; constantly using the microwave; playing guitars, video games, computers, radios, etc. etc. - our electric ran around $110 a month before the state deregulated our power supply.
now, with just myself & my husband here - the bill averages $290 in winter (oil heat stays on 66 degrees) and $415 in summer w/ fans/air running only when absolutely necessary (above 80 degrees or super high humidity). we pay 25 cents per kilowatt for electricity and we are due for planned increases again in april, june and august that have nothing to do with obama's plan.
i don't get how he expects people to pay these bills... especially in this economy.
CV
I don't know either...I have done all I can to weather proof my abode...but the bill just keeps climbing...in good weather, i dry clothes outside, i stopped using my dishwasher. I never leave the T.V. on like I use to...I turn off lights..the price of food has gone up...everything is going up...I wonder if President Obama could loan me some money?????? heck maybe we all should ask, can't hurt
Peregrine(Endangered)-
Number of posts : 1132
Age : 82
Location : Delaware
Job/hobbies : Gardening, Birding
Humor : lots
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
i'm curious peregrine... can you do me a favor? take the total of your electric bill and divide it by the number of kilowatts you used during that billing cycle. that will tell how much you pay per kilowatt... i'm curious what that number is in Delaware...Peregrine(Endangered) wrote:Susan aka CV wrote:same thing happened here a acouple of years ago, peregrine.Peregrine(Endangered) wrote:Lordie...my local electric company use to be regulated...the state recinded the regulation and we are paying higher elect. fees already...what the hell can we do!!!...I'm heading for the mountains.hehehe
when our 2 kids were here and tons of their friends leaving lights on; opening the refrigerator 100 times a day; constantly using the microwave; playing guitars, video games, computers, radios, etc. etc. - our electric ran around $110 a month before the state deregulated our power supply.
now, with just myself & my husband here - the bill averages $290 in winter (oil heat stays on 66 degrees) and $415 in summer w/ fans/air running only when absolutely necessary (above 80 degrees or super high humidity). we pay 25 cents per kilowatt for electricity and we are due for planned increases again in april, june and august that have nothing to do with obama's plan.
i don't get how he expects people to pay these bills... especially in this economy.
CV
I don't know either...I have done all I can to weather proof my abode...but the bill just keeps climbing...in good weather, i dry clothes outside, i stopped using my dishwasher. I never leave the T.V. on like I use to...I turn off lights..the price of food has gone up...everything is going up...I wonder if President Obama could loan me some money?????? heck maybe we all should ask, can't hurt
as i said, ours is 25 cents per klwt here in CT... and get this - my family in indiana pays 6 cents.... it's disgusting.
want money from obama? maybe we should create an application for a personal bailout with, of course, no repayment requirements; fill it out and mail it to the white house! hmmm.... which national newspaper do ya think would be most likely to publish a full page ad with the app included..??
CV
Susan aka CV- Number of posts : 380
Location : Connecticut - for now anyway
Registration date : 2009-02-28
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
I pay 11.96 cents per KWH...its crazy how it differs..25 cents per KWH...maybe I should keep my mouth closed...
Peregrine(Endangered)-
Number of posts : 1132
Age : 82
Location : Delaware
Job/hobbies : Gardening, Birding
Humor : lots
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
don't freak out yet peregrine... look at it again - i think the decimal is throwing you off. if you round it up, it's 12 cents per k - which is still double what it is in the midwest - and far more than you should be expected to pay, especially right now.Peregrine(Endangered) wrote:I pay 11.96 cents per KWH...its crazy how it differs..25 cents per KWH...maybe I should keep my mouth closed...
maybe you can clarify how things work in de - but here, our power comes from out of state now, which show as "generation" charges on the bill. THEN our local electric company charges us for "delivery" on top of that... and then there's all the taxes and state/federal fees, etc. etc. on top of that which make up the total bill. that total; divided by the number of ks used = price per k.
but wth - the ceos have to get their bonuses from somewhere, right?
CV
Susan aka CV- Number of posts : 380
Location : Connecticut - for now anyway
Registration date : 2009-02-28
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
it may not pass, i don't know what he has in store for us, but i know that it's for his good and ultimately ours. it may not go as we wished it would, but what we wish for is not always what's best for us. maybe this is the beginning of the end of this world on earth, i don't know but i do know i'm doing the best i can to serve him and i'm not worried at all about that. he never promised us that we'll be happy, or healthy or rich-just eternal salvation-which in the end is what's it's all about. i love you too.Susan aka CV wrote:so val, you're telling me "this too, shall pass"..?HotParadox wrote:this is not meant to down play anything that you've said, because imo, you are spot on. all i can tell you is to have faith that God will do His will for His good and ultimately our good. the devil loves it when we are fearful because it is testimony that we have little faith that God will do what's ultimately for His and our benefit. He's the source of my optimism and i know that you are a woman of faith, so please don't despair. it's our job to do the best we can and then allow Him to be the manager of all the outcomes of our lives.
well girl - i hope you have enough faith for both of us on this one, cuz this is one time i'll believe it when i see it happen.
gluttony got us into this mess; we all played a part in it on one level or another; and i'm not asking, nor do i expect God to intervene in the outcome. but that's me. i'll deal with it.
just know i hear what you're saying from your heart, and for that - i love you and thank you.
xoxo
HotParadox-
Number of posts : 4051
Location : Boston
Registration date : 2009-01-13
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
understoodHotParadox wrote:it may not pass, i don't know what he has in store for us, but i know that it's for his good and ultimately ours. it may not go as we wished it would, but what we wish for is not always what's best for us. maybe this is the beginning of the end of this world on earth, i don't know but i do know i'm doing the best i can to serve him and i'm not worried at all about that. he never promised us that we'll be happy, or healthy or rich-just eternal salvation-which in the end is what's it's all about. i love you too.Susan aka CV wrote:so val, you're telling me "this too, shall pass"..?HotParadox wrote:this is not meant to down play anything that you've said, because imo, you are spot on. all i can tell you is to have faith that God will do His will for His good and ultimately our good. the devil loves it when we are fearful because it is testimony that we have little faith that God will do what's ultimately for His and our benefit. He's the source of my optimism and i know that you are a woman of faith, so please don't despair. it's our job to do the best we can and then allow Him to be the manager of all the outcomes of our lives.
well girl - i hope you have enough faith for both of us on this one, cuz this is one time i'll believe it when i see it happen.
gluttony got us into this mess; we all played a part in it on one level or another; and i'm not asking, nor do i expect God to intervene in the outcome. but that's me. i'll deal with it.
just know i hear what you're saying from your heart, and for that - i love you and thank you.
xoxo
xoxo
Susan aka CV- Number of posts : 380
Location : Connecticut - for now anyway
Registration date : 2009-02-28
Re: Get your check books out... Here comes "Cap & Trade"
Kazza wrote:Is it really going to be that much? How much is the average electricity bill over there? I thought you guys had cheap coal to burn for electricity like us.
Yes, it's really going to be that much. The estimates are, that it will cost the average American household and extra $700 to $1,400 per year. Thats aproximently $60 to $120 per month.
As for coal burning plants, they are the ones that will be hit the hardest by the "Cap & Trade" plan.
Grim17-
Number of posts : 430
Age : 59
Location : Phoenix, Arizona
Registration date : 2009-01-17
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